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Hudud..is relevan at present time??
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Edited by Truth.8 at 12-2-2015 11:27 AM
Let discuss this topic in healthy way rather name calling and etc...
Everyone are welcome to share their view …
My view : Hudud is outdate at present time….or in simple put...not relevant at present time...
Is not relevant . Besides, huduh only makes the country backwards and leads to poverty….this truthwhere many country like Afghanistan in stake of poverty… Country like Arabs and Brunei has implemented the hudud but one must understand the main economy is oil…this has flourished their economy growth… within several yrs to come, when the oil is dry up…than this both country will leads to poverty… Hudud will make more investor to think twice before they investing in our country…some professional might think to migrate…only leaving the unprofessional behind in this country…as for me, yes I surly will move out if such law implemented …. Secondly does the hudud law created by Supreme? Or is man made law?Does this hudud was a ancient law before islam born? Does Muhammad copy this hudud which is ancient law into islam?? In Islamic law, that is Sharia, hudud crimes trigger a class of punishments that are fixed by God. These range frompublic lashing, publicly stoning to death, amputation of hands or publicexecution. [7] However,public stoning and execution punishments are relatively uncommon in the moderntimes in most Muslim nations, and are currently witnessed in Muslim nations,such as SaudiArabia and Iran,that follow strictest interpretation of sharia. [2][8]
I have seen muslims putting banner or kind of sticker...Saya sokong hudud...have you peoples really wonder or think what is the implication if such law enforced?? or is because someone is good and god law so we need to obey....are we sure this from God??
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There is something very wrong with you. I already asked you the question of what is your problem with Hudud after providing a lengthy explanation of what would trigger the Hadd punishment.
Like a snake you slinked away from responding but come back with the same issues. Why is this so? Issit that you are unable to respond with facts but choose to repeat the same emotional arguments over and over again.
What has Hudud got to do with a country economic condition? One is the maximum limit of the law whereas the other is how a country is being managed.
Don't you think you are being a bit idiotic.
Why continuously bring up a topic that you are scared to even respond to the issues put forth?
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Edited by hajimex at 12-2-2015 11:48 AM
pertama sekali...
kalau boleh... fahami dan ambil tahu dulu apa itu hudud dan sebagainya...
bukan senang-senang "curi! potong tangan!"
ini antara bahan bacaan yang boleh dibaca...
http://www.al-azim.com/masjid/infoislam/jinayat/mencuri.htm
https://www.facebook.com/EddyWan.IamMuslim/posts/230883360388010
saya bukan pakar hudud ya!
orang islam akan ikut quran dan sunah... quran dan sunah takkan lapuk dek zaman... logiknya ada... sebab itu saya cakap... fahami dan ambil tahu dulu apa itu hudud...
"Definisi yang dapat dipetik dari penulisan mereka mengenai hudud ialah ; Hukum-hukum yang tertentu yang ditentukan oleh Allah sama ada melalui al-Quran atau Sunnah Nabi Muhammad s.a.w sebagai Hak Allah yang dikenakan ke atas pesalah-pesalah yang telah melakukan kesalahan-kesalahan yang tertentu yang digolongkan di dalam jenayah Hudud, iaitu tujuh jenis seperti yang diterangkan oleh al-Quran iaitu..."
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Edited by Truth.8 at 12-2-2015 12:16 PM
kalau boleh... fahami dan ambil tahu dulu apa itu hudud dan sebagainya...
bukan senang-senang "curi! potong tangan!"
ini antara bahan bacaan yang boleh dibaca...
ini yg jadi TANDA TANYA pada umat islam skg....masih tidak pasti tapi heboh pasal hudud...kamu kata bukan senang2 curi potong tangan....tapi dlm isu ini kalau curi potong tangan.... kalau curi benda yg besar maka potong tangan????
sila huraikan
Pencuri ialah mengambil harta orang lain dengan cara bersembunyi dan diambil daripada tempat pertaruhan (tempat yang layak untuk menyimpan harta itu). Mencuri itu adalah salah satu daripada dosa-dosa besar dan mewajibkan potong tangan ke atas si pencuri itu.
Sebagaimana dengan firman Allah yang bermaksud:
”Pencuri lelaki dan pencuri perempuan hendaklah kamu potong tangannya sebagai balasan pekerjaan, dari siksaan daripada Allah, Allah maha perkasa lagi maha bijaksana”
jadi, pencuri tangan harus di potong....ada fikir masa depan dia?? tidak kah undang2 yg sedia ada boleh membantu orang ini insaf di penjara?? pasti dia akan sedar di penjara kerana penjara ini adalah satu tempat pengajaran utk pesalah....di situ ada kuliah agama di ajar utk kesedaran....soft approached....tidakah ini akan membantu seorang pesalah kearah yg baik supaya kembali pada ajaran agama masing2??
http://www.al-azim.com/masjid/infoislam/jinayat/mencuri.htm
saya bukan pakar hudud ya!
orang islam akan ikut quran dan sunah... quran dan sunah takkan lapuk dek zaman... logiknya ada... sebab itu saya cakap... fahami dan ambil tahu dulu apa itu hudud...
mulut memang lah senang ckp....contoh lah kamu curi 20,000 ribu.....dua tangan kena potong....macam mana kamu nak hidup?? nak buang besar siapa nak tolong kamu? makan siapa nak bantu kamu? tidak kah ini semua satu beban pada diri kamu dan orang lain?
sebab itu saya ckp adakah hudud ini relevan skrg???
"Definisi yang dapat dipetik dari penulisan mereka mengenai hudud ialah ; Hukum-hukum yang tertentu yang ditentukan oleh Allah sama ada melalui al-Quran atau Sunnah Nabi Muhammad s.a.w sebagai Hak Allah yang dikenakan ke atas pesalah-pesalah yang telah melakukan kesalahan-kesalahan yang tertentu yang digolongkan di dalam jenayah Hudud, iaitu tujuh jenis seperti yang diterangkan oleh al-Quran iaitu..."
tujuh jenis?? sila huraikan..terima kasih
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yang kedua...
buka minda dulu... jangan sempitkan minda... dan baca betul-betul dan habiskan pembacaan di link yang diberikan itu...
dan sekali lagi... saya cakap... saya bukan pakar... dan bukan maksud saya tidak tahu... atau bodoh... cuma saya takut tersalah sampaikan... saya cuma boleh arahkan atau tunjukkan saja... sebab itu saya tolong cari artikel yang boleh anda baca... tapi malangnya anda tidak baca...
sebab apa saya tahu anda tidak baca habis? jawapan kepada soalan anda ada di kedua-dua link... contohnya... hudud takkan hukum potong kedua-dua tangan terus...
"1) Mencuri kali pertama hendaklah dipotong tangan kanannya.
2) Mencuri kali yang kedua hendaklah dipotong kaki kirinya dan,
3) Mencuri kali ketiga dan berikutnya hendaklah dikenakan hukuman takzir dan dan dipenjarakan sehingga ia terbunuh."
kalau hudud dilaksanakan... saya takkan berani mencuri langsung... dan bila hukuman dijalankan dikhalayak ramai... saya agak yakin tiada orang yang berani mencuri lagi... |
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saya dah baca:
PENCURI
Pencuri ialah mengambil harta orang lain dengan cara bersembunyi dan diambil daripada tempat pertaruhan (tempat yang layak untuk menyimpan harta itu). Mencuri itu adalah salah satu daripada dosa-dosa besar dan mewajibkan potong tangan ke atas si pencuri itu.
Sebagaimana dengan firman Allah yang bermaksud:
”Pencuri lelaki dan pencuri perempuan hendaklah kamu potong tangannya sebagai balasan pekerjaan, dari siksaan daripada Allah, Allah maha perkasa lagi maha bijaksana”
(Surah Al- Maidah ayat 38)
Sabda Rasulullah s.a.w. yang bermaksud:
”Tidak dipotong tangan seseorang pencuri itu kecuali seperempat dinar atau lebih daripada nilai wang mas”
dlm quran itu sendir dah sebut potong tangan dan di hadis lain kamu punya rasul kata tidak potong tangan...kecuali seperempat dinar atau lebih...
tidak kah hudud ini masih kabur lagi?? tapi aku heran...bukan main orang muslims berteriak hendak hudud tapi masih tidak memahami isu ini
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kalau hudud dilaksanakan... saya takkan berani mencuri langsung... dan bila hukuman dijalankan dikhalayak ramai... saya agak yakin tiada orang yang berani mencuri lagi...
contoh...kalau anak kamu curi harta orang ...dua tangan potong.....macam mana masa depan dia? kamu nak menyara hidup dia sepanjag hayat atau kerajaan sebab dua belah tangan tiada???
kalau di masuk di penjara...pasti dia akan kembali insan yg baik...maka dia akan kerja dgn jalan yg benar.....macam saya kata tadi...di penjara ada kuliah agama , ada kursus utk banduan...jadi adakah huduh relevan skg? tidak sekali...
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dia bukan kabur... cuma orang selalu cakap benda ringkas... curi... hukumnya potong tangan...
sama macam contohnya kalau orang tahu... undang-undang negara... contoh ya... tali gantung... so orang akan cakap... bunuh... hukumnya tali gantung... tapi dalam kes bunuh sendiri ada tahap dia... kalalu jumpa bukti ini dan ini... tahap ketiga... penjara saja... kalau semua bukti ada... baru tahap pertama... dan hukumnya tali gantung... dan itupun bergantung pada perbicaraan dan penghakiman...
itu sekadar contoh ya...
jadi itu sama macam hudud untuk curi... tidak cukup bukti dan sebab... tidak boleh jatuhkan hudud potong tangan... mungkin hanya sekadar hukuman qisas atau takzir... (yang ini memang di luar ilmu saya... saya cuma tahu permukaan saja... hakim atau peguam atau orang yang belajar hudud pasti boleh terangkan lebih terperinci...) dan itupun juga bergantung pada perbicaraan dan penghakiman...
saya tidak pasti saya sudah bagi link ini atau belum...
https://www.facebook.com/EddyWan.IamMuslim/posts/230883360388010
ya... saya setuju dengan anda... saya sendiri rasa kesal... contoh orang yang tidak tahu macam anda... dan memang ingin pelajari atau ingin tahu... terus dikecam... tanpa dijelaskan... atau apa...
dan maaf... macam saya cakap... saya bukan pakar... saya hanya boleh tunjukkan arah atau memandu anda saja...
saya yakin dengan hudud... kerana datangnya daripada Allah... (seperti yang saya cakap di atas tadi)
CUMA! saya harap dapat DIJELASKAN dan DILAKSANAKAN dengan benar.... |
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nanti saya balas ..nak log out...nak ke gym
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Edited by sam1528 at 12-2-2015 03:13 PM
Truth.8 replied at 12-2-2015 11:22 AM
Cool down....dont get anger...anger is part satan...
Nothing wrong with me. I created this topic because soly on hudud...other topic which created by meenachi sepi different issue.
I dunno. My perception is that I am dealing with a person who has got no capacity to understand anything let alone learn anything. I think this is an accurate description of you.
I did ask you what is yoru problem with Hudud after a lengthy explanation. You did not answer but come up with another thread bringing up the same issues. There is something mentally wrong with you.
If you think me like snake slinked away, how come I have created this topic???
Then why did you not respond to the question in the other thread. Instead you ask the same question in this new thread. Why so auta wan?
Have you live in afghanistan or iran? why many peopels from iran miragte to other country ? experience it.
What has Afghanistan and Iran got to do with Hudud? Afghanistan has a government that controls only part of the country whereas Iran is about identical to the British Parlimentary System. Afghanistan has been torn apart by wars , first from the Soviets then the Americans / British. Iran has been under international sanction for the last 30 odd years.
What is your argument all about? Hudud has got nothing to do with Afghanistan nor Iran.
Can you focus on the proper issues?
just because opening this thread me being idiotic??
Don't you think so? I think so because you did not respond to the questions posed about what is your issue with Hudud but open up a new thread asking the same questions. I am beginning to think that there is something wrong with you.
scared?? since when? i been here since 2001...does it sound me scared or run away?? i hve seen many muslims like Gb , Kenkid and few others scared and left ...me ? still staying...does sound me scared??
So let me ask you again....by chopping off hand if one would commit crime....do you know this will effect the person life in long run???
1). without hands- he/she not able to work....he/she need to depend on goverment, public and this will burden everyone...
2). if hudud not implemented, this person will be send to prison to be punished according to modern law....while in lock up...the person will change.....when he/she leave the prison....he/she will contribute possitive direction for himself and country....not burden to others because in prison...I believed convict are taught how to be Independent ...teaching them in many skills using both HANDS.....this will leads such person to move forward to positive directions....
if hudud are enforced....there will be negative in such person...staying home, no hands....and most important:
BUANG AIR BESAR( going toilet for shit) , he/she need someone to help....does is logic to have such law of hudud at present time?
Muslims need to use think before agree on hudud..like i said one should ask...is this law of hudud from GOD?
You are still here because you are thick skinned and don't mind to be embarassed to no end.
(1) Why are you assuming that both hands need to be chopped? I thought I provided the conditions of chopping off a person's hand post#13 , #14 , #26
Why are you still arguing that chopping off the hands is already assumed? Does a professional thief contribute anything to society?
(2) Statistics have proven you wrong again. People who goes to jail are mostly repeated offenders. This means that jailing them do not change them for the better. A professional thief is a person who makes stealing his life career. Your argument is based on assumption however the fact of the matter is the opposite. Can you start to deal with facts and reality?
Again I ask you with the restrictive qualifications pertaining Hudud , what is you rproblem with it? Can you give real life examples or statistics that is in support of your argument. If not , you are just arguing for the sake of arguing because it is already known that you hate Islam.
The following is an injunction in the bible (NIV)
mat5:29-30
29 If your right eye causes you to stumble, gouge it out and throw it away. It is better for you to lose one part of your body than for your whole body to be thrown into hell.
30 And if your right hand causes you to stumble, cut it off and throw it away. It is better for you to lose one part of your body than for your whole body to go into hell.
mat18:8-9
8 If your hand or your foot causes you to stumble, cut it off and throw it away. It is better for you to enter life maimed or crippled than to have two hands or two feet and be thrown into eternal fire.
9 And if your eye causes you to stumble, gouge it out and throw it away. It is better for you to enter life with one eye than to have two eyes and be thrown into the fire of hell.
mark9:42-47
42 “If anyone causes one of these little ones—those who believe in me—to stumble, it would be better for them if a large millstone were hung around their neck and they were thrown into the sea.
43 If your hand causes you to stumble, cut it off. It is better for you to enter life maimed than with two hands to go into hell, where the fire never goes out.
[44] 45 And if your foot causes you to stumble, cut it off. It is better for you to enter life crippled than to have two feet and be thrown into hell. [46] [c]
47 And if your eye causes you to stumble, pluck it out. It is better for you to enter the kingdom of God with one eye than to have two eyes and be thrown into hell,
You believe that the above are the actual words of Jesus whom you regard being God. Why are you not following such injunction? It is even worse. There is no conditions like in Hudud but just on a rationale by the offender.
Maybe you should ask yourself is this from God (which you believe the bible is from your God and Jesus is your God). It says basically the same but there is no restrictive qualifications like in Hudud.
Yet you have a problem with Hudud? There is something wrong with you. |
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Edited by Truth.8 at 12-2-2015 05:06 PM
I dunno. My perception is that I am dealing with a person who has got no capacity to understand anything let alone learn anything. I think this is an accurate description of you.
you may think whatever about others...preception is only perception which not good. i m sure islam never teaches about that right? i never have perception on you or others because im God fearing p erson
I did ask you what is yoru problem with Hudud after a lengthy explanation. You did not answer but come up with another thread bringing up the same issues. There is something mentally wrong with you.
the problem teachings of hudud itself..till now muslims support hudud but when kafir like me would post question...they not sure...they jumping here and there in full of doubt....which hudud build in very shaky foundation...
[/quote]
[quote]Then why did you not respond to the question in the other thread. Instead you ask the same question in this new thread. Why so auta wan?
i create this topic on the issue hudud related to hand chopping..the other thread which created by meenachi sep about rape.......is too difficutl for u understand
[/quote]
[quote]
What has Afghanistan and Iran got to do with Hudud? Afghanistan has a government that controls only part of the country whereas Iran is about identical to the British Parlimentary System. Afghanistan has been torn apart by wars , first from the Soviets then the Americans / British. Iran has been under international sanction for the last 30 odd years.
...but they do practised hudud which hand chopping and stonning women to dead ...dont tell u never aware of it? or auta again
What is your argument all about? Hudud has got nothing to do with Afghanistan nor Iran.
it related on hudud....are you saying they not muslim?
Can you focus on the proper issues?
yes i am..the hudud...any problem explaning??
Don't you think so? I think so because you did not respond to the questions posed about what is your issue with Hudud but open up a new thread asking the same questions. I am beginning to think that there is something wrong with you.
u can think whatever you want....i hve reason to create this topic..u can answer it if u wish than coming with your excuses like 'something wrong with me and the bla bla bla things....
So let me ask you again....by chopping off hand if one would commit crime....do you know this will effect the person life in long run???
did you read in the post i type......or pretending? of course...when both hands are chop off for the crime...how he/she going support??
with present law is good enough when he/she going to prison and given the lesson there...surly the person comes back in positive direction when he/she learn the skills while in prison... if both hand chop off...he/she is burden to goverment and the rest...
...and if/she want to eat , going to toilet ...who going assist him/her?? u? or peoples who endorsed the hudud law??
to implement hudud law is easy.....but the conscientious will effect the person who carrying it include the society and goverment...
so, u think chopping off hand which endorsed by hudud law is relevant at present time?
1). without hands- he/she not able to work....he/she need to depend on goverment, public and this will burden everyone...
2). if hudud not implemented, this person will be send to prison to be punished according to modern law....while in lock up...the person will change.....when he/she leave the prison....he/she will contribute possitive direction for himself and country....not burden to others because in prison...I believed convict are taught how to be Independent ...teaching them in many skills using both HANDS.....this will leads such person to move forward to positive directions....
if hudud are enforced....there will be negative in such person...staying home, no hands....and most important:
BUANG AIR BESAR( going toilet for shit) , he/she need someone to help....does is logic to have such law of hudud at present time?
Muslims need to use think before agree on hudud..like i said one should ask...is this law of hudud from GOD?
You are still here because you are thick skinned and don't mind to be embarassed to no end.
(1) Why are you assuming that both hands need to be chopped? I thought I provided the conditions of chopping off a person's hand post#13 , #14 , #26
Why are you still arguing that chopping off the hands is already assumed? Does a professional thief contribute anything to society?
(2) Statistics have proven you wrong again. People who goes to jail are mostly repeated offenders. This means that jailing them do not change them for the better. A professional thief is a person who makes stealing his life career. Your argument is based on assumption however the fact of the matter is the opposite. Can you start to deal with facts and reality?
which post??? but the quran says hand chop off if stealing....are you contradicting ??
a professional theif can be jail harsh punishment...not choping hand off...
Again I ask you with the restrictive qualifications pertaining Hudud , what is you rproblem with it? Can you give real life examples or statistics that is in support of your argument. If not , you are just arguing for the sake of arguing because it is already known that you hate Islam.
not such thing about hate islam ...u always has such bad feeling on kafir..which very bad.. my argument is simple...hudud is not relevant at present time...we go forward according time and year...not outdated law...
The following is an injunction in the bible (NIV)
mat5:29-30
29 If your right eye causes you to stumble, gouge it out and throw it away. It is better for you to lose one part of your body than for your whole body to be thrown into hell.
30 And if your right hand causes you to stumble, cut it off and throw it away. It is better for you to lose one part of your body than for your whole body to go into hell.
mat18:8-9
Talking about islam not bible...thank you
You believe that the above are the actual words of Jesus whom you regard being God. Why are you not following such injunction? It is even worse. There is no conditions like in Hudud but just on a rationale by the offender.
Where was hudud during Jesus time? we no longer live such law.....u sore loser ...are you?
Yet you have a problem with Hudud? There is something wrong with you.
even muslim women says do not support hudud....something wrong with her? many do not agree on hudud...something wrong or is something wrong with u??
Hudud @ Wiki
The main focus on Hudud law includes:
1.Drinking alcohol (sharb al-khamr, شرب الخمر)
2.Theft (as-sariqah, السرقة)
3.Highway robbery (qat`a at-tariyq, قطع الطريق)
4.Illegal sexual intercourse (az-zinā', الزناء)
5.False accusation of illegal sexual intercourse (qadhf, القذف) [1]
6.Apostasy (irtidād or ridda, ارتداد) - includes blasphemy.
2 & 3 which are considered serious criminal offense, while 1,4, 6 are direct disrespect with the religion & belief, 5 incriminating others, what about other beliefs in the religion, i.e Fraud, Lying, eating Pork, disrespect to other people, rempiting etc? Or are they not interested in the rest of the crimes from their islamic point of view because put it simply the law didn't included these in the 1st place?
What do you guys think about this? Why only Hudud? Why not all islamic laws including Qisas, Diyya, Tazir? Is PAS trying to push this law to reduce crimes in the state or they just pushing it to make the state more islamic?
Islamic Law @ Wiki
We already have Syariah court & separate punishment here for Muslims do we need another set of stringent & lethal way for punishment for muslim offenders? Would the court be capable enough to come out with the right judgements?
If this were ever implemented would this be the beginning of a separate islamic country, due to the fact that the law is very different from civil? Would people especially muslims start to move out of the state due to the harsh punishment? Would this spread throughout the countries? It won't effect the non-muslims, when it starts but would it end up like in some middle east countries where everybody are subject to the law, i.e non muslims getting punished for eating in public during fasting month
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Truth.8 replied at 12-2-2015 04:50 PM
you may think whatever about others...preception is only perception which not good. i m sure isl ...
Hmmm.....
Jika kamu lihat implikasi hudud dengan jauh mungkin kamu boleh faham dengan amat mudah sekali.
Dari segi psikologi, pengajaran yang diperoleh orang ramai apabila melihat hudud peringkat akhir dilaksanakan iaitu sah menggelapkan duit syarikat( mencuri), keputusan hakim setalah di dapati benar2 bersalah maka hukumannya potong sebelah tangan.. (contoh) dengan syarat si pengkhianat seorang yg berakal dan sihat fikirannya. Hukuman tidak sah kepada kanak2 tidak cukup umur yg belum dewasa atau orang gila (contoh) dan hanya didenda membayar sejumlah wang pampasan sebagai ganti(sekali lagi contoh) berdasarkan budi bicara hakim.
Kesan dari hal yg demikian akan memberi impak yg sangat besar kepada moral dan jiwa umum. Antaranya akan lebih amanah dalam berbisnes, dan mengurangkan jenayah curi di kalangan masyarakat.
Ia mendidik kita supaya beringat2 dan menghormati hak orang lain. Hukuman hudud itu tidak langsung menyusahkan manusia. Ia tidak menjejaskan siapa jua.
Manusia lah yang suka berbuat kejahatan. Dan meminta supaya diampunkan, dan kemudian terus mengulangi lagi perbuatan keji, dan minta nyawa, mengulangi lagi kesilapan dan berulang proses ini sehingga ke hujung nyawa nya selagi hidup bebas.
Tampak hudud zalim, namum ia tidaklah zalim langsung, malah jika dilihat kesan nya untuk jangkamasa panjang, ia menyelamatkan sejuta jiwa daripada jenayah daripada satu jiwa zalim yg terkorban. Atau inginkah anda melihat sejuta jiwa membuat kesilapan yg sama? Dan menambahkan generasi yg terus merosakkan kualiti kehidupan akan dtg?
Anda pasti mempersoalkan perkara paling utama di fikiran anda. Iaitu bagaimana nasib keluarga penjenayah jika dia adalah seorang breadwinner dalam famili? Siapakah yg akan membela nasib anak isteri dan ibu bapa yg masih mengharap padanya??
Apakah dia sendiri tidak mampu berfikir hal itu? Bukankah dia sepatutnya lebih bertanggungjawab dalam setiap tindak tanduknya?
Jadi ia adalah atas diri sendiri.
Yg perlu berhati2 dan menjaga keselamatan masa depan famili tersebut.
Islam bukan agama yg zalim, malah mengajar kita menjadi manusia yg lebih baik, menghindarkan dari kejahatan manusia pengkhianat yg tidak reti mengambil pengajaran dari kisah kisah lalu.
Jika anda rajin, boleh buka alquran dan baca kisah umat yang menderhaka pada perintah Tuhan, biarpun didakwah untuk kembali ke pangkal jalan, diberi peluang untuk bertaubat, mereka masih ingkar dan melampaui batas, lalu diturunkan berbagai bala ujian. Inilah yg sebenarnya memberi pengajaran dan keinsafan kepada manusia generasi baru untuk menjadi lebih baik dan bijak membuat keputusan yg benar, serta menjauhi kezaliman.
Dek kerana kebuasan nafsu yg suka berbuat jahat, kita menyalahkan hukuman. Kita lupa untuk merenung diri sendiri. Dan inilah yg terus terjadi kepada setiap generasi, tanpa penyelesaian yg betul.
Pandanglah secara terbuka dan menilai dengan sewajarnya isu ini. Ianya mudah untuk semua yg patuh, tetapi amat sukar untuk mereka yg cinta zalim.
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Edited by sam1528 at 12-2-2015 10:35 PM
Truth.8 replied at 12-2-2015 04:50 PM
you may think whatever about others...preception is only perception which not good. i m sure islam never teaches about that right? i never have perception on you or others because im God fearing p erson
LOL , my perception on you comes with facts. You never answer any question but just repeat the same issues again and again despite lengthy explanation. This shows that you are unable to understand what others state much less learn from it. Take for example , bro hajimex in post#4 has provided the link stating that only 1 hand is cutoff. However you still come back and argue about cutting off both hands. This is evidence that you are unable to understand anything much less learn something. Are you that bad in your comprehension and understanding?
the problem teachings of hudud itself..till now muslims support hudud but when kafir like me would post question...they not sure...they jumping here and there in full of doubt....which hudud build in very shaky foundation...
The one with shakey foundation is you. As far as it goes , you refuse to understand anything but come back with the same refuted argument over and over again. This can only mean one thing , you don't understand what the argument is all about. In short you have limited intellectual capacity to understand issues.
i create this topic on the issue hudud related to hand chopping..the other thread which created by meenachi sep about rape.......is too difficutl for u understand
In the actual case , you are the one trying to run from this issue. You are the one who brought up 'chopping off the hands' in that particular thread , your post#10 in that particular thread. Why are you running from issues that you brought up? Issit because you don't have any answers? Worse still , your understanding of the whole issue is crappy at best. LOL , despite lengthy explanation you still insist that it is chopping of both hands. You do not come across being a smart person.
...but they do practised hudud which hand chopping and stonning women to dead ...dont tell u never aware of it? or auta again
Ok , can you now give me the full process of which these so called people chop hands and stone a women to death. Can you then relate it to the steps that has been provided and tell me whether the full Islamic position has been exercise. Lets see if you are able to do that. If not , I can safely say here , there is no Hudud.
it related on hudud....are you saying they not muslim?
A community can be a muslim but not practice Hudud. What has Hudud got to do with Afghanistan or Iran?
yes i am..the hudud...any problem explaning??
Lengthy explanation has been made but you are not smart enough to understand. Case in point is that explanation has already been made about cutting off a hand however you still come back and argue about cutting off both hands. Either you are extremely stupid or drunk pretending to be sober or you are just a troll.
u can think whatever you want....i hve reason to create this topic..u can answer it if u wish than coming with your excuses like 'something wrong with me and the bla bla bla things....
There is something wrong with you. Despite lengthy explanation you still argue about the same thing. Only people with lesser intelligence does such. Are you or lesser intelligence or is there is actually something wrong with you?
did you read in the post i type......or pretending? of course...when both hands are chop off for the crime...how he/she going support??
with present law is good enough when he/she going to prison and given the lesson there...surly the person comes back in positive direction when he/she learn the skills while in prison... if both hand chop off...he/she is burden to goverment and the rest...
...and if/she want to eat , going to toilet ...who going assist him/her?? u? or peoples who endorsed the hudud law??
to implement hudud law is easy.....but the conscientious will effect the person who carrying it include the society and goverment...
so, u think chopping off hand which endorsed by hudud law is relevant at present time?
1). without hands- he/she not able to work....he/she need to depend on goverment, public and this will burden everyone...
2). if hudud not implemented, this person will be send to prison to be punished according to modern law....while in lock up...the person will change.....when he/she leave the prison....he/she will contribute possitive direction for himself and country....not burden to others because in prison...I believed convict are taught how to be Independent ...teaching them in many skills using both HANDS.....this will leads such person to move forward to positive directions....
if hudud are enforced....there will be negative in such person...staying home, no hands....and most important:
BUANG AIR BESAR( going toilet for shit) , he/she need someone to help....does is logic to have such law of hudud at present time?
Muslims need to use think before agree on hudud..like i said one should ask...is this law of hudud from GOD?
You are still here because you are thick skinned and don't mind to be embarassed to no end.
The real question here , which church taught you that in Hudud , BOTH hands are chopped off as per your continuous argument? The link (post#4) by bro hajimex stated only one hand. In the same veinThe injunction is to cut off one not both hands. There is consensus among jurists that in the event of the first theft the right hand should be cut off. This punishment has been laid down for theft alone.
Even such there are lots of conditions to be fulfilled before the so called chopping off the hand which has been explained.
Are you that below average in intelligence that you cannot comprehend an explanation in simple english? Why are you arguing on imaginary issues? 'Basuh berak' lah , laws from God lah but you cannot even understand what 'one hand' against 'both hands' mean. To you one hand = both hands .... issit? If so , no wonder you are arguing thru you rear end. You don't even know what is the context / meaning of 'one hand' as opposed to 'both hands'.
This is very poor from you. LOL , you being a 40 odd years old person is still struggling to understand what 'one hand' entails as opposed to 'both hands'. You should be embarrassed with yourself. Why advertise your stupidity?
which post??? but the quran says hand chop off if stealing....are you contradicting ??
a professional theif can be jail harsh punishment...not choping hand off...
LOL , the gall of it all. You still ask 'which post'? Did you not click on the link I provided? This is so poor of you. I hate to say this but this is extreme stupidity from you. You have not done any reading but still argue on your imaginary issues. Only people with below par intelligence argue in the manner you do. Do you have a problem with reading something. The simpler question .... do you know how to read?
Put a professional thief in jail and repeat the process over and over again. This again support my argument that statistics confirm of repeated offenders. Another way to look at it is that you preserve a thief's hand so that he can steal again. Then you complain about thieves. You are not solving the problem , are you?
not such thing about hate islam ...u always has such bad feeling on kafir..which very bad.. my argument is simple...hudud is not relevant at present time...we go forward according time and year...not outdated law...
Your posts are all full of imaginary issues about Islam with no facts in support. Only haters resort to such arguments. Being critical is ok but being critical without evidence is just hatred , in which you are full of it.
What is your reason that Hudud is not relevant in present time? If you say cutting of both hands therefore the person cannot 'basuh berak' is stupidity to an extreme because there is no injunction for cutting off both hands for one incident of theft. You are just arguing from your rear end. I have asked this question for more than 3 times. You have not answered but keep on giving imaginary issues plus repeating yourself like a broken record. Yes , there is something wrong with you.
mat18:8-9
Talking about islam not bible...thank you
Where was hudud during Jesus time? we no longer live such law.....u sore loser ...are you?
Are the biblical verses provided not Hudud? It is cutting off a person's hand. Why are you so scared when we compare issues with the Bible? Issit because you have no answers. Then you should understand your own bible in greater depth.
TQ , you are affirming that your bible (which you believe to be the word of God) and your God in Jesus is not relevant nowadays.
even muslim women says do not support hudud....something wrong with her? many do not agree on hudud...something wrong or is something wrong with u??
They can say whatever they want to say. However when we come to facts of the argument , we can see that there is nothing to fear from Hudud. The question is still , if you don't agree , what is your issue? So far there is no argument that can confirm Hudud is bad.
Hudud @ Wiki
The main focus on Hudud law includes:
1.Drinking alcohol (sharb al-khamr, شرب الخمر)
2.Theft (as-sariqah, السرقة)
3.Highway robbery (qat`a at-tariyq, قطع الطريق)
4.Illegal sexual intercourse (az-zinā', الزناء)
5.False accusation of illegal sexual intercourse (qadhf, القذف) [1]
6.Apostasy (irtidād or ridda, ارتداد) - includes blasphemy.
2 & 3 which are considered serious criminal offense, while 1,4, 6 are direct disrespect with the religion & belief, 5 incriminating others, what about other beliefs in the religion, i.e Fraud, Lying, eating Pork, disrespect to other people, rempiting etc? Or are they not interested in the rest of the crimes from their islamic point of view because put it simply the law didn't included these in the 1st place?
What do you guys think about this? Why only Hudud? Why not all islamic laws including Qisas, Diyya, Tazir? Is PAS trying to push this law to reduce crimes in the state or they just pushing it to make the state more islamic?
Islamic Law @ Wiki
We already have Syariah court & separate punishment here for Muslims do we need another set of stringent & lethal way for punishment for muslim offenders? Would the court be capable enough to come out with the right judgements?
If this were ever implemented would this be the beginning of a separate islamic country, due to the fact that the law is very different from civil? Would people especially muslims start to move out of the state due to the harsh punishment? Would this spread throughout the countries? It won't effect the non-muslims, when it starts but would it end up like in some middle east countries where everybody are subject to the law, i.e non muslims getting punished for eating in public during fasting month
LOL , do you know what is Hudud , Qisas, Diyya, Tazir? I bet the other muslims are laughing their asses off at you. I will not spoonfeed you. Why don't you read up on these things and try to understand what you read. Then look in the mirror and ask yourself why do you ask the following question :
Why only Hudud? Why not all islamic laws including Qisas, Diyya, Tazir?
Why can't the court come up with the right judgement as there is already stringent guidelines on the application of Hudud? This has been explained in length yet you still have problems understanding. The problem is you in your inability to understand what you read.
A person who does no wrong would not be afraid of Hudud.
Why should a non muslim be punished if he eats during Ramadhan? He / she is not required to fast. These are less than intelligent , imaginary issues.
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by sam
LOL , my perception on you comes with facts. You never answer any question butjust repeat the same issues again and again despite lengthy explanation. Thisshows that you are unable to understand what others state much less learn fromit. Take for example , bro hajimex in post#4 has provided the link stating thatonly 1 hand is cutoff. However you still come back and argue about cutting offboth hands. This is evidence that you are unable to understand anything muchless learn something. Are you that bad in your comprehension and understanding?
Well someone like u not capable of answering my question, will always viewsuch…..because they have no idea how todebate in peaceful manner rather full of vengeance..
The one with shakey foundation is you. As far as it goes , you refuse tounderstand anything but come back with the same refuted argument over and overagain. This can only mean one thing , you don't understand what the argument isall about. In short you have limited intellectual capacity to understandissues.
Where I don’t understand? Proof to me? Or u running away again from my question? Or auta again?? In the actual case , you are the one trying to run from this issue. You are theone who brought up 'chopping off the hands' in that particular thread , yourpost#10 in that particular thread. Why are you running from issues that youbrought up? Issit because you don't have any answers? Worse still , yourunderstanding of the whole issue is crappy at best. LOL , despite lengthyexplanation you still insist that it is chopping of both hands. You do not comeacross being a smart person.
The fact remain same as what the hadis andquran says….chopping off hand ….so, I counter attacked back and bringmy view such act is outdated which not relevant todate…
.. .Ok , can you now give me the full process ofwhich these so called people chop hands and stone a women to death. Can youthen relate it to the steps that has been provided and tell me whether the fullIslamic position has been exercise. Lets see if you are able to do that. If not, I can safely say here , there is no Hudud.
A young guy age 18 who stole handphone…why such punishment? This guys can be arrested and send to prison for motivation and others. I can provide list of link how hudud punishment was enforced ….this need to bechange
A community can be a muslim but not practice Hudud. What has Hudud got to dowith Afghanistan or Iran?
How do you know that? Auta again??
Lengthy explanation has been made but you are not smart enough to understand.Case in point is that explanation has already been made about cutting off ahand however you still come back and argue about cutting off both hands. Eitheryou are extremely stupid or drunk pretending to be sober or you are just atroll.
Either one or two….it do not make differences…thereis a way to handle issue…in malaysia syaria court is good enough…
if hudud implemented…this leads toseparation of muslims which leads tomany problem might arise.
There is something wrong with you. Despite lengthy explanation you still argueabout the same thing. Only people with lesser intelligence does such. Are youor lesser intelligence or is there is actually something wrong with you?
=========================================
Something wrong with me or with u?
The real question here , which church taught you that in Hudud , BOTH hands arechopped off as per your continuous argument? The link (post#4) by bro hajimexstated only one hand. In the same vein The injunction is to cutoff one not both hands. There is consensus among jurists that in the event ofthe first theft the right hand should be cut off. This punishment has been laiddown for theft alone.
One or two do not make differences…..is not fromGOD…is GOD so barbaric??my God never endorsed such…HE IS LOVE… Do we need to act like GOD to act such??? In due time those does that…azab will come uponthem as GOD will give warning after warning…such small azab ..if not changesdone…big one…I have seen this …so, we do not need act like GOD…
here is muslim scholar reject hudud...
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memang lah mulut sedap ckp...cuba buat lah hudud...negara ini jadi mcm zombie land...ramai akan keluar dari malaysia....
syariah court is good enough...
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Edited by sam1528 at 13-2-2015 12:46 AM
Truth.8 replied at 12-2-2015 11:17 PM
by sam
Well someone like u not capable of answering my question, will always viewsuch…..because they have no idea how todebate in peaceful manner rather full of vengeance..
Where I don’t understand? Proof to me? Or u running away again from my question? Or auta again??
The fact remain same as what the hadis andquran says….chopping off hand ….so, I counter attacked back and bringmy view such act is outdated which not relevant todate…
LOL , all you have are 2 videos from an islamophobe and you believe it hook , line and sinker. That is why I stated that you are just a dimwitted troll. There are numerous scholarship on this issue but you choose a bigot christian video to argue your case. In short you are just a christian bigot with a shallow understanding of almost everything. Do you know that religious leaders in Somalia have already condemn Al Shabab to be extremist? LOL , you don't know because you are just a from in the well.
How do you know that? Auta again??
Either one or two….it do not make differences…thereis a way to handle issue…in malaysia syaria court is good enough…
if hudud implemented…this leads toseparation of muslims which leads tomany problem might arise.
Something wrong with me or with u?
One or two do not make differences…..is not fromGOD…is GOD so barbaric??my God never endorsed such…HE IS LOVE…
Do we need to act like GOD to act such??? In due time those does that…azab will come uponthem as GOD will give warning after warning…such small azab ..if not changesdone…big one…I have seen this …so, we do not need act like GOD…
here is muslim scholar reject hudud...
For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.
Act like God? Why are you so dimwitted. Even in the bible , your biblical God states of chopping off the hand. Somehow you interpret and argue that one is acting like God because following what has been commanded. Can you sober up and think intelligently.
LOL , no where in the video Tariq Ramadan state that Hudud is outdated. He states that one needs to understand what is the requirement , conditions for such to be implemented. Even in listening to something , you cannot make an accurate assessment. Requirement and conditions of Hudud is what has been explained time and time again to you but you lack the intelligence to understand.
There is something very wrong with you.
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Too many questions on consequences but still within "WHAT IF" this or that.
If this is applicable to stop implementation of Hudud why not do the same method of "WHAT IF" to the other Act? |
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Truth.8 replied at 12-2-2015 11:19 PM
memang lah mulut sedap ckp...cuba buat lah hudud...negara ini jadi mcm zombie land...ramai akan k ...
Kenapa xberani ke? Kami sedia hudud dijalankan.
Haha kalau takut jadi zombie silalah keluar dari Malaysia ni. |
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Post time 12-2-2015 10:52 AM
变色卡
Author
Post time 13-2-2015 10:29 AM
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