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LOGIC is the science of thinking

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Post time 25-2-2005 11:09 PM | Show all posts |Read mode
b4 we can think correctly卨earn to recognize the common fallacies of logic
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Post time 26-2-2005 01:23 PM | Show all posts
Salam Bulan卆pa kabar??...............:hug:

Bagi Anis lah... misconception resulting from incorrect reasoning..amatlah bahaya.Tidak semua kebenaran berasal sesuatu yang logik di akal.. Kebenaran itu adalah bergantung pada keadaan dan kewarasan adalah apabila kita  menggunakan logik sebagai landasan berfikir dan bukannya hukuman sekadar untuk lari dari keadaan.

Bagi Anis, jika kita mencampur adukkan logic dalam kehidupan kita akan keliru kerana tidak semua dasar dasar lojik itu logik卻ebagai contoh:hmm:

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1.Dalam sebuah mahkamah seorang pembunuh dijatukan hukuman mati kerana membunuh.

2. Alasannya dia dihukum bunuh kerana  membunuh itu adalah satu kekejaman.

3. Maka hukuman bunuh itu sendiri adalah satu kekejaman kerana hukuman bunuh itu adalah membunuh.

4.Maka apa bezanya antara kita dengan pembunuh.

So dalam soal ini logic akan mencelarukan fikiran dan tindakan

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 Author| Post time 27-2-2005 10:50 PM | Show all posts
Originally posted by Tengku Anis at 26/2/05 01:23 PM:
Salam Bulan卆pa kabar??...............:hug:

Bagi Anis lah... misconception resulting from incorrect reasoning..amatlah bahaya.Tidak semua kebenaran berasal sesuatu yang logik di akal.. Ke ...

:hug:hi, Anis...not thinking logically...bzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz...:bgrin:

I like to kaitkan logik dr. segi penyampaian mesej...sesuatu mesej
akan menjadi 'ambiguos' or tidak logik...jika tiada schemata or not
enuff background knowledge...

cth. saya akan menulis...

the gunners only managed a tie...

jadik mereka yang mempunyai schemata tentang konteks ayat ini akan
memahami kelogikan mesej ini...kalau yang tidak ada enuff background
knowledge utk konteks ayat ini...tentu pelik dan meragui kelogikan ayat
ini....yang bermaksud...Pasukan Arsenal hanya berjaya mendapat seri dlm
perlawanannya...bukan berkenaan senapang ataupun talileher:devil:
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Post time 28-2-2005 11:32 PM | Show all posts
Originally posted by seribulan at 2005-2-27 03:50 PM:

:hug:hi, Anis...not thinking logically...bzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz...:bgrin:

I like to kaitkan logik dr. segi penyampaian mesej...sesuatu mesej
akan menjadi 'ambiguos' or tidak logik...jika tiada sch ...


Ha a lah Bulan, Anis ni memang tk logik sebab tu tak boleh jadik angkasawan :bgrin:

Kalau dari segi bahasa...dah di kira simpulan bahasa....
macam "Ali dapat Dapat Duit terpijak" kalau orang yang tak tau mesti ingat yang Ali terpijak duit :bgrin:
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Post time 1-3-2005 09:34 AM | Show all posts
Originally posted by Tengku Anis at 2005-2-28 11:32 PM:


Ha a lah Bulan, Anis ni memang tk logik sebab tu tak boleh jadik angkasawan :bgrin:

Kalau dari segi bahasa...dah di kira simpulan bahasa....
macam "Ali dapat Dapat Duit terpijak"  ...

salam anis..bulan...

:hmm:...dalam jugak ni nak pikir...
tapi intan setuju dgn anis...
tidak semua kebenaran dapat diasaskan kpd logik biar pun logik itu dapat mengasaskan kebenaran.
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Post time 3-3-2005 03:25 AM | Show all posts

salam,

Hampir semua bidang ilmu mempunyai kaitan dgn logik.  So logik boleh dianggap alat atau basic kpd bidang ilmu.

Apa yg pasti...

Logik sering dikongkong oleh apa yg dilihat, didengar, dirasai, dihidu dan disentuh.

Contoh..

Kita rasa our friend marah kat kita bila dia bermasam muka...  walau pun sebenarnya dia sedang bimbang ttg masalah peribadinya.

Kita dikongkong oleh persepsi.  Kita berasa sesuatu berlaku tetapi ia sebenarnya tidak berlaku...disebabkan kita ingin ia berlaku.
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Post time 4-3-2005 10:48 AM | Show all posts
Tapi memang betul sains berasaskan logik...

Biasanya apa saja yg diteorikan dalam sains perlu dibuktikan secara tampaknya.
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Post time 26-3-2005 05:51 PM | Show all posts
posted by..seribulan
the gunners only managed a tie...
yah,memang betul saya memang tak tahu the gunners tu Arsenal,ingat orang yang pegang gun itu draw sesama diri....

posted by..Tengku Anis
Duit terpijak
simpulan bahasa ker..maksudnya..

NIce topic keep it up..
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 Author| Post time 31-3-2005 03:03 PM | Show all posts
more on fallacies...

TWO WRONGS MAKE A RIGHT, TU QUOQUE..Variant of the Ad Hominen fallacy. The Tu Quoque fallacy involves attempting to evade criticism by pointing out that your opponent is as bad as you are. E.g. "Look who's talking!" Or "You hit me first!"

BEGGING THE QUESTION, PETITIO PRINCIPII..An argument which assumes some unproven or unstated "fact" which is designed to stump any objection. In question form, this is known as a Complex Question. E.g. "Vegetarianism is much better for you because you cut out all meat from your diet." Or "Have you stopped beating your wife?"

COMPOSITION...An argument that is based on the fallacious assertion that, if certain members of a group express certain traits then, the whole group expresses those traits. E.g. "A person with a USM-sticker on their car nearly ran me off the road; all USMers are hypocrites."

EMOTIONAL APPEALS...Appeals to Fear, Pity or Loyalty (among others). Emotions are not always irrelevant in making good decisions. Feelings of compassion and love, among others, can be quite relevant to a given issue. You may have good reason for setting out on a particular course of action on account of your compassion for a group of people. When one bases an entire argument on "scare-tactics", black-mail or an attempt to garner sympathy because of the current state of the arguer, then the argument fails. Because emotions, while powerful motivators, do not constitute logical grounds for believing one thing or another.  E.g. "If you love me, you'd go to the store and get me some ice cream."

RED HERRING..Variant of Irrelevant Reasons. This fallacy is named after supposed tactics used by escaped convicts; in order to escape the pursuing bloodhounds, the convict would drag a stinking fish behind him and then toss it off to one side in the hope that the strong smell would divert the dogs from his trail.

A Red Herring fallacy consists of introducing an emotionally charged statement, which while possibly true in itself, is designed to divert attention from a weak argument.E.g. "Man, if we lived in China you'd be thrown in jail forever for talking that way about our leaders."

SLIPPERY SLOPE...An argument which fallaciously attempts to show that by taking step A, step Z will come to pass. Once you step onto the path started at point A, you are likely or even be compelled to continue to step Z. While there may be a natural casual link between each step, a fallacious argument of this type cautions us to avoid the first step without giving us proof that we won't be able to go back. E.g. "If I make an exception for you, I'll have to make an exception for everyone."
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 Author| Post time 1-4-2005 11:11 PM | Show all posts
Originally posted by seribulan at 31/3/05 03:03 PM:
more on fallacies...

TWO WRONGS MAKE A RIGHT, TU QUOQUE..Variant of the Ad Hominen fallacy. The Tu Quoque fallacy involves attempting to evade criticism by pointing out that your opponent is as  ...

:hmm: tertinggal lak...Ad Hominem tu apa...:bgrin:

nasi tambah...

AD HOMINEM "against the person" ...Reverse of the Appeal to Authority. The Ad Hominem argument rejects an idea based on who subscribes to or promotes it. It is also more commonly called a "personal attack"; instead of attacking the argument or position, the arguer is attacked. Note that all personal attacks are not fallacious. Sometimes the personal character of person does matter in an argument.

E.g. the fact that a politician is a known white collar criminal may just be relevant to a discussion of his re-election, even though that does not, in and of itself, invalidate the bill (his ideas) he has just introduced.

AD HOMINEM-CIRCUMSTANTIAL..Form of Ad Hominem. This is a case where the argument is rejected, not on the personality of an opponent but, on some circumstances which supposedly makes the arguer an unreliable source. While it is extremely important to understand the point of view of the person presenting an argument, where a person comes from, their social and economic situation and background, or even education level, these things do not directly effect the quality of the argument itself.

E.g."Hey, I hear our governor was once homeless. How could a homeless person know how to balance a budget, more less a multi-million dollar one?"

FALSE DILEMMAS use the process of elimination (disjunctive syllogism) in which the list of alternatives that are presented is incomplete. Often this list leaves out important alternatives or presents the list in misleading ways. In another form, a False Dilemma presents alternatives which we really do not have to choose between; that is, the choices are not mutually exclusive.

E.g. "eople that protest the war in Iraq are either slaves of the U.N., Socialists or Al-Quida sympathizers."  

BIFURCATION.. Species of False Dilemma in which only two choices are given. This is usually expressed in black-and-white or all-or-nothing thinking.

E.g."If you don't like America, you can always go back to the country you came from."
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Post time 3-4-2005 12:26 AM | Show all posts
adatak cara cara yang boleh menukarkan otak ke lebih logikal sikit....
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 Author| Post time 23-4-2005 10:09 AM | Show all posts
just use ur brain to think thru everything before making a decision....
refer the pro n cons....
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Post time 23-6-2005 06:46 PM | Show all posts
Hehe..sebenarnye nak sharpen logical thinking ni...banyak buat maths...the more critical probs...the more kite boleh nampak menda yg logik...

Korang sedar tak...kita blajar kebarangkalian dalam statistik...menda tu banyak bantu dalam hidup....especially bila nak buat decision...

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Post time 2-7-2005 02:38 PM | Show all posts
Seribulan wrote:

tertinggal lak...Ad Hominem tu apa...

AD HOMINEM "against the person" ...Reverse of the Appeal to Authority. The Ad Hominem argument rejects an idea based on who subscribes to or promotes it. It is also more commonly called a "personal attack"; instead of attacking the argument or position, the arguer is attacked. Note that all personal attacks are not fallacious. Sometimes the personal character of person does matter in an argument.


There is a caveat,not all ad homs are fallacious,i.e. such as criticism of someone.Like it is perfectly rational to argue that someone who lies or cheats a lot cannot be trusted in an argument.

Just to add another:

anthrocentric fallacy --- Consider the example of a preacher who one day takes someone supposedly possessed of a demon, throws his hand on her forehead, and shouts, "Get out! Leave this body!" Even supposing that demons exist, one might find it curious that they understand English, obey peremptory commands, and are easily influenced by incantations and rituals. The a.f. here occurs at the presupposition level: human language, reason, instincts, and desires are assumed to be the orbit around which everything else in the universe (including the aforementioned demons) revolve.
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Post time 2-7-2005 02:41 PM | Show all posts

RED HERRING..Variant of Irrelevant Reasons. This fallacy is named after supposed tactics used by escaped convicts; in order to escape the pursuing bloodhounds, the convict would drag a stinking fish behind him and then toss it off to one side in the hope that the strong smell would divert the dogs from his trail.


thanks,finally I khow why they call it red-herring.
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Post time 23-11-2005 01:21 AM | Show all posts
Originally posted by Atomic_Omnikid at 3-4-2005 12:26 AM
adatak cara cara yang boleh menukarkan otak ke lebih logikal sikit....


Ada...

1.  Kita perlu meluaskan dan mendalamkan cara kita melihat sesuatu.  Ini mengelakkan kita dr terkonkong oleh kawalan persepsi

2.  Kita harus melihat jauh ke hadapan dan cuba membuat ramalan pd tindakan kita dgn berpandukan fakta dan maklumat.

3.  Kita perlu mengubah cara melihat sesuatu keadaan, benda, peristiwa dll dgn tekun iaitu dr masa ke semasa.  Ini krn pemikiran yg mengawal kemampuan dlm mengubah corak kehidupan sedia ada, faktor luaran hanya mampu memberi pengaruh kpd kita shj.  Kita perlu berazam melakukan sesuatu bg meningkatkan kualiti kehidupan.

4.  Kita dpt mengubah persepsi2 dgn menukar nilai negatif kpd positif, misalnya motivasi dan self esteem.

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