WHAT THE BIBLE SAYS ABOUT MUHAMMAD (PEACE BE UPON HIM) THE PROPHET OF ISLAM

Originally posted by sparrow at 20-8-2006 08:58 PM



Yes. While Jesus was on earth as a man, He carried to us the message from the Father. He did prophecy what would be happenig after He died on the cross and rose back up to heaven. He did prop ...

Deuteronomy 18:18.  "I will raise them up a Prophet from among their brethren,
                                    like unto thee,
                                    and I will put my words in his mouth;
                                    and he shall speak unto them all that I shall command him."


This verse is sent to Moses, does it mean Moses is same like JESUS ? The line "like unto thee" means like you. Can explain further in what way Moses is same like Jesus ?

Originally posted by weedkiller at 20-8-2006 08:52 PM

great then, prove that's a prophecy. i've already shown u the verse and the concordance there. prove it.


so do you want to talk about Jesus' prophecy or not? because previously you said that ...

so do you want to talk about Jesus' prophecy or not? because previously you said that it's offtopic. and i asked you 2 simple question regarding the prophecy of jesus. is there anyone else with the name or contains the name "Christ" in the bible? Secondly is there any other person born of the virgin birth other than Jesus in the bible? Just answer yes or no. simple as that

I have already told u i didnt deny either its a prophecy about Jesus, but my question is does it mentioned explicitly JESUS by name? Just answer yes or no, simple as that.

great then, prove that's a prophecy. i've already shown u the verse and the concordance there. prove it.

I have already shown everything to you. U havent shown me to which prophet it refers to, its u who must prove me wrong.

why do i say i do not have to tell you? because it's not me who claims that the verse is a prophecy. and yes matter of fact i don't know because i'm not God. but are you God since you know that it refers to Muhammad? or you're just playing a game of tikam? or should i say "tikam with vague facts?"

In which line did i say im GOD ? Are you trying to get an easy way out ?

sparrow

Originally posted by SilentKiller at 20-8-2006 09:45 PM
This verse is sent to Moses, does it mean Moses is same like JESUS ? The line "like unto thee" means like you. Can explain further in what way Moses is same like Jesus ?

i thought someone said that he only wants to discuss on whether the prophecy relates to Muhammad, i thought he doesn't want to talk about Jesus...
But oh well.. now that you asked...

1) Moses was an Israelite.
So is Jesus. Jesus is descended from of Abraham, through the line of Judah..

2)Moses was to be killed when he was an infant.
Jesus was to be killed by Herod when he was an infant.

3) personal knowledge of God, and  mighty works

Deuteronomy 34:10-12
Since then, no prophet has risen in Israel like Moses, whom the LORD knew face to face, 11 who did all those miraculous signs and wonders the LORD sent him to do in Egypt - to Pharaoh and to all his officials and to his whole land. 12 For no one has ever shown the mighty power or performed the awesome deeds that Moses did in the sight of all Israel.

There was no one else like that.. apart from Jesus. Jesus, like Moses, knew the Father face to face too, and did miraculous signs and wonders, and showed the mighty power too and awesome deeds too

3a) Moses spoke with God face to face. Moses speaks and heard from God directly, not through an intermediary and not through visions either. And he spoke God's direct words to him, to the people.
Jesus too, have seen the Father and spoke with the Father face to face.. and He too, speaks and heard directly from the Father.. not through intermediaries nor visions. Jesus too, spoke God's direct words to people.
John 1:18 - "No one has ever seen God.  It is God the only Son who is close to the Father's heart, who has made him known."

John 17:5 - "So now, Father, glorify me in your own presence with the glory that I had in your presence before the world existed."

Matthew 17:5 - "While he was still speaking, suddenly a bright cloud overshadowed them, and from the cloud a voice said, "This is my Son, the Beloved; with him I am well pleased; listen to him!"

It is believed that Muhammad did not hear directly from God, but through angel Gabriel.. no?


3b) Moses's face shone when he went up to Mount Sinai and spoke with God face to face.
Jesus's face too, shone, when He went up a mountain and spoke with God face to face.
Exodus 34:29
29 When Moses came down from Mount Sinai with the two tablets of the Testimony in his hands, he was not aware that his face was radiant because he had spoken with the LORD.

Matthew 17:2
1After six days Jesus took with him Peter, James and John the brother of James, and led them up a high mountain by themselves. 2There he was transfigured before them. His face shone like the sun, and his clothes became as white as the light.

3c) Moses performed many miracles during his life.
Jesus too, performed many miracles while He was on earth.


4) Moses led the people out of Egypt (a place of bondage) to the promised land, ie Canaan.
Jesus leads people (ie, us) out of a place of bondage (ie, from bondage of sin) to the promised land, ie, heaven.

[ Last edited by  sparrow at 20-8-2006 11:21 PM ]

ussopp

do we need a judge here?

because some question that has been answered is asked again and again...and again

is there any clearer or proper method that can be practiced...???

I have already told u i didnt deny either its a prophecy about Jesus, but my question is does it mentioned explicitly JESUS by name? Just answer yes or no, simple as that.

earlier on you asked me if there's any prophecy relating jesus. i gave you one. so it's my turn to ask. but instead of answering you shot me with another question. answer my question first and i'll give you my answer then.

I have already shown everything to you. U havent shown me to which prophet it refers to, its u who must prove me wrong.

i didn't say it was a prophecy. and i said that the verse doesn't relate to anyone. do you understand what i'm saying there? and i'm not proving you wrong. forgive my ignorance but i just want to know is there any written or verbal agreement that 'brethren' there must be the Arabs. thats all. is it hard for you? or do you want me to translate the question into your prefered language?

In which line did i say im GOD ? Are you trying to get an easy way out ?

yes thank you for reminding me. yes i did not say you're a god but i asked you if you're a god since you know that the verse claims to be muhammad when there's no muhammad's name written in that verse. read it properly.

Originally posted by sparrow at 20-8-2006 10:21 PM


i thought someone said that he only wants to discuss on whether the prophecy relates to Muhammad, i thought he doesn't want to talk about Jesus...
But oh well.. now that you asked...

1) Mos ...

1)In the FIRST place Jesus is not like Moses, because, according to You - 'JESUS IS A GOD', but Moses is not God

2)SECONDLY, according to You - 'JESUS DIED FOR THE SINS OF THE WORLD', but Moses did not have to die for the sins of the world.

3)THIRDLY, according to You - 'JESUS WENT TO HELL FOR THREE DAYS', but Moses did not have to go there.

4)Moses had a father and a mother. Muhummed also had a father and a mother. But Jesus had only a mother, and no human father

5)Moses and Muhummed were born in the normal, natural course, i.e. the physical association of man and woman; but Jesus was created by a special miracle.

6)Moses and Muhummed married and begat children, but Jesus remained a bachelor all his life.

7)Moses and Muhummed were accepted as prophets by their people in their very lifetime. No doubt the Jews gave endless trouble to Moses and they murmured in the wilderness, but as a nation, they acknowledged that Moses was a Messenger of God sent to them. The Arabs too made Muhummed's life impossible. He suffered very badly at their hands. After 13 years of preaching in Mecca, he had to emigrate from the city of his birth. But before his demise, the Arab nation as a whole accepted him as the Messenger of Allah. But according to the Bible: 'He (Jesus) CAME UNTO HIS OWN, BUT HIS OWN RECEIVED HIM NOT.' (John 1:11). And even today, after two thousand years, his people- the Jews, as a whole, have rejected him.

8)"Moses and Muhummed were prophets as well as kings. A prophet means a man who receives Divine Revelation for the Guidance of Man and this Guidance he conveys to God's creatures as received without any addition or deletion. A king is a person who has the power of life and death over his people. It is immaterial whether the person wears a crown or not, or whether he was ever addressed as king or monarch: if the man has the prerogative of inflicting capital punishment - HE IS A KING. Moses possessed such a power. Do you remember the Israelite who was found picking up firewood on Sabbath Day, and Moses had him stoned to death? (Numbers- 15:13). There are other crimes also mentioned in the Bible for which capital punishment was inflicted on the Jews at the behest of Moses. Muhummed too, had the power of life and death over his people.  

9)Both Moses and Muhummed died natural deaths, but according to Christianity, Jesus was violently killed on the cross.

Therefore i conclude MOSES is not like JESUS.

earlier on you asked me if there's any prophecy relating jesus. i gave you one. so it's my turn to ask. but instead of answering you shot me with another question. answer my question first and i'll give you my answer then.

I didnt ask for prophecy about JESUS, but i asked u if JESUS mentioned explicitly by name it the prophecy ? You only gave me prophecy.

i didn't say it was a prophecy. and i said that the verse doesn't relate to anyone. do you understand what i'm saying there? and i'm not proving you wrong. forgive my ignorance but i just want to know is there any written or verbal agreement that 'brethren' there must be the Arabs. thats all. is it hard for you? or do you want me to translate the question into your prefered language?

First of all, its a clear cut prophecy, but u say its not. Can u tell me what is the criteria for a prophecy ? Sparrow also admit its a prophecy. Why should there be written agreement that brethren must be Arabs ? I have already told u the meaning of brethren on that verse.

yes thank you for reminding me. yes i did not say you're a god but i asked you if you're a god since you know that the verse claims to be muhammad when there's no muhammad's name written in that verse. read it properly.

You dont have to be a GOD to prove something, maybe for u if u wanna prove something u have to be GOD ? :hmm:

First of all, its a clear cut prophecy, but u say its not. Can u tell me what is the criteria for a prophecy ? Sparrow also admit its a prophecy. Why should there be written agreement that brethren must be Arabs ? I have already told u the meaning of brethren on that verse.

hooray then, it's a prophecy. so where does it says that it has to be Arabs? is your meaning of brethren a fact or an assumption? why did oxford gave a different meaning to brethren? questions yet to be answered. pffft i'm getting bored.

and by the way. how is muhammad to be compared to moses in the first place?
did moses went to war?
does moses have more than 1 wife?
did moses get a 6 year old as his wife?
did muhammad performed any miracles like moses?

hmmmm :hmm: :hmm: :hmm: :hmm:

sparrow

Go thy way, Silentkiller. Interpret it whatever way you want, but according to the Bible, Acts chapter 3 specifically points the prophecy to the Lord Jesus Christ.
As for similarities between Jesus and Moses, we believe they are the ones which i've pointed to you above - miraculous deeds and personal knowledge of the Father in heaven. Human parents, marriage, children, earthly prophets and kings - many other prophets also have them. These are very normal attributes possessed by many people, there is nothing in these attributes that made the prophets stand out from the rest. For eg, King David, King Solomon, they also have human parents, marriage, children, they are also prophets and kings... but  why are they not equated to Moses as well?)

Well.. go thy way, interpret the prophecy whatever way you want.. but just don't say the Bible says it.

Bateesta

Everybody claimed that they r rite:hmm:
Whn u guys 1 2 stop , huh ?
It takes u guys 2 no where , no answer n no solution

But u r wht u 1 2 believe , so proceed guys...

greekgod

let see something different...

11 And the vision of all is become unto you as the words of a book that is sealed, which men deliver to one that is learned, saying, Read this, I pray thee: and he saith, I cannot; for it is sealed:

12 And the book is delivered to him that is not learned, saying, Read this, I pray thee: and he saith, I am not learned.

Chapter 29, The Book of Isaiah, KJV.

If we read the history of Muhammed, when Gabriel first approached him for the first revelation, "Iqra (Read)", and Muhammad replied something like "i cannot read". and history also recorded that Muhammed was illiterate.

Therefore, what do you think Bible was prophesying about?

Originally posted by greekgod at 21-8-2006 11:15 PM
let see something different...

11 And the vision of all is become unto you as the words of a book that is sealed, which men deliver to one that is learned, saying, Read this, I pray thee: and he ...

Monkey God Sun Wu Kong!

nightlord

Sorry Greeky, half of the muslim world and all the muslim scholars do not agree with you.

Muhammad can read and does it very well.

You should forget the old wife's tales and do some real research.

nightlord

And Muhammad cannot be prophesised in the Bible/Torah because ALL ISLAMISTS AND MUHAMMAD himself proclaims that the people of the book have corrupted the real word of God and the Bible/Torah are no longer reliable.

So why do you want to use these books as reference?

Aren't you contradicting yourself?

actually i only see silentkiller's the only one who's doing a hardwork here. while is 'brethrens' are sitting out there. :D

[ Last edited by  weedkiller at 22-8-2006 01:14 AM ]

greekgod

hehehe... 13friday, please dont contradict history or becoming historian of your own.

first of all, please quote your source.. or better in Malaysia itself, any Muslim scholars stated the fact that mohammed is well learnt.

dont be a liar here.. thanks...

Originally posted by weedkiller at 21-8-2006 02:39 PM

hooray then, it's a prophecy. so where does it says that it has to be Arabs? is your meaning of brethren a fact or an assumption? why did oxford gave a different meaning to brethren? questions ye ...

Sorry for late reply, quite bz

So now u admit its a prophecy, can u tell me why now only u admit its a prophecy? If its a prophecy, u must tell me to which person that verse meant to ? Let me ask u something, is brethren means Israelite to you ? Where do you find it ?
If u find its boring here, thats not my problem, no one forced u to do anything. Regarding the differences between Moses and Jesus, let me give u 3 major differences between JESUS and MOSES, Jesus is said to be GOD, Moses is not, Jesus died for the sins of the world, Moses didnt died for the sins of the world, Jesus went to hell for three days, Moses didnt have to go there. So, that prophecy couldnt be JESUS.

Originally posted by sparrow at 21-8-2006 10:58 PM
Go thy way, Silentkiller. Interpret it whatever way you want, but according to the Bible, Acts chapter 3 specifically points the prophecy to the Lord Jesus Christ.
As for similarities between Jes ...

Well sprarrow, let me give u 3 major difference between Moses and Jesus, Jesus is said to be GOD, Moses is not, Jesus died for the sins of the world, Moses didnt died for the sins of the world, Jesus went to hell for three days, Moses didnt have to go there. So, that prophecy couldnt be JESUS.

So now u admit its a prophecy, can u tell me why now only u admit its a prophecy? If its a prophecy, u must tell me to which person that verse meant to ?

perhaps you don't understand the concept of sarcasm

Let me ask u something, is brethren means Israelite to you ? Where do you find it ?

i told the New Living Translation is written there Israelite. Even if there's no word Israelite there, i certainly don't see the word Arabs or Muhammad there as well. and where's my answer to the question? can't dig it out?

If u find its boring here, thats not my problem, no one forced u to do anything. Regarding the differences between Moses and Jesus, let me give u 3 major differences between JESUS and MOSES, Jesus is said to be GOD, Moses is not, Jesus died for the sins of the world, Moses didnt died for the sins of the world, Jesus went to hell for three days, Moses didnt have to go there. So, that prophecy couldnt be JESUS.

hey i gave you FOUR major differences :D let's see who can bring out more differences.
did moses went to war?
does moses have more than 1 wife?
did moses get a 6 year old as his wife?
did muhammad performed any miracles like moses?

perhaps you don't understand the concept of sarcasm

I dont see any sarcasm in your reply. U just admit its a prophecy, dont you ?

i told the New Living Translation is written there Israelite. Even if there's no word Israelite there, i certainly don't see the word Arabs or Muhammad there as well. and where's my answer to the question? can't dig it out?

Why your new living translation translate "brethren" to Israelite ? Certainly brethren doesnt meant Israelite. I have already explained the meaning brethren regarding the verse in my previous reply, u just dig it up if u already forgot.

hey i gave you FOUR major differences :D let's see who can bring out more differences.
did moses went to war?
does moses have more than 1 wife?
did moses get a 6 year old as his wife?
did muhammad performed any miracles like moses?

Its not a major difference for me.