Is God comprise of One, Two Or Three. One God BUT TWO

Truth.8

Page1

THE TWO MEMBERS OF ELOHIM

The Bible begins with, "In the beginning God created
the heavens and the earth " (Gen. 1:1, New International
Version). Most people assume there was one Great Being
who planned and did the creating. But the word "God" in
Hebrew is Elohim, it means Mighty Ones. There was more
than one Creator !

Gen. 1:26 says : "Let US make man in OUR image, in
OUR likeness. . . .(NIV). Some people think God was
talking to the angels, if this was so, the angels were co-
creators of man and man was made in the image of angels.
But this is not what the Bible teaches.

Plural pronouns are used three times in the verse, this
proves that must have been more than One Member in the
Elohim Creating Team. Since man was made like Elohim,
Elohim Members have human-like faces and shapes !

So, how many God-persons were there creating the
universe and the earth ?

The Bible always explains itself.

The first verse of the Gospel of John tells us : "In the
beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and
the Word was God" {NIV). This verse is so wonderful and
powerful yet so simple ; before the creation there existed a
Being called the Word, He existed side by side with another
Being who was simply called God and this same Word was
in the same status as God, He was God as God was God !

..../cont'd

Truth.8

Page 2 (cont'd 1)

Verse 3 states every created life and object in the
universe was made by the Word. This makes the Word the
Creator. Heb.l:2, Col. 1:16 and Eph.3:9 all tell us God did
the creating work through Christ - this means before
anything was made - there existed TWO BEINGS in the
status of Eternal Almighty God !

One of the Elohim was called The Word - The Logos -
because He was the Spokesperson for the Elohim Team
while the other was simply known by the Family Name of
God or Elohim because He was the chief of the Elohims.
About 4000 years after Adam was made, the second
Elohim emptied Himself of divine glory to become a man
(Phil.2:7, John 1:14). He became Jesus of Nazareth.

When Jesus the Man was on earth. He testified, " Why
do you call Me good ? No one is good but one, that is,
God" (Mark 10:18, NKJV). Jesus bore witness there was
ONE BEING in Heaven at the time of His sojourning on
earth. When the demons saw Jesus, they cried out, " We
know who You are - the Holy One of God." These
rebellious spirits recognized Jesus was the OTHER ONE
pre-existing with God. One plus one equals two ! There
were TWO BEINGS in the Godhead !
Consider this : if the Holy Spirit was a third person
existing together with the Word and God, then John 1:1
should be written in this manner : In the beginning was the
Word and the Spirit, and the Word and the Spirit -were with
God, and were God.

But there is no such statement in the Book of John or
in the rest of the Bible. This itself proves God is not a
Trinity of Beings.


con't/.....

[ Last edited by Truth.8 on 28-6-2004 at 04:17 PM ]

Truth.8

Page 3 (con't)

In the King James Version Bible, also called the
Authorized Version, there is this verse : " For there are
three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word and
the Holy Spirit, and these three are one "(I John 5:7).

This verse is a late inclusion by the translators of the
King James Version. It seems this verse was interpolated by
Trinitarian-influenced scribes in the 17th century \ It was
not part of the original Greek text. All the modem
translations omit it - it is nothing but a fraud !

Jesus reveals there are Two of Them !

Throughout the book of John, Jesus stated - at least 40
TIMES - He WAS SENT by God the Father. So there were
TWO PARTIES involved : the One who sent and the One
who was sent.

The One who sent was the FATHER. And the ONE
AND ONLY Father sent His ONE AND ONLY SON -
JESUS CHRIST (John 1:14). The One who sent and the
One who was sent cannot be the same person - you cannot
sent yourself, someone else has to sent you. Many - many -
of the statements made by Jesus in the book of John
contained in one form or other the message : HE SENT ME
(John 7:29, 8:29). HE SENT ME cannot mean one person
and if there seems to be a third person in the Godhead,
Jesus seems to leave Him out in many of His statements.

What is the conclusion then ?

God consists of the Father and the Son ; They are
TWO PERSONS ! Simple as that ! The Christian God is

con't/....

Truth.8

Page 4(con't)

not Trinitarian nor Unitarian but Binitarian (twoness) - if
one may use a modem secular term.

In His great prayer before His arrest and trial, Jesus
looked up to Heaven and said, "Father the hour has come.
Glorify Your Son that Your Son also may glorify You. ....

... ... .this is eternal life, that they may know You, the

Only True God and Jesus Christ whom You have sent....

. . and now, 0 Father, glorify Me together with Yourself
with the glory which I had with You before the world was"
(John 17:1-5,NKJV).

These are profound words.

Jesus looks up to Heaven because He knows God is
bodily present there. He calls Him Father and claims to be
His Son. This means Jesus is not the Father and the Father
is not Jesus. They are separate persons, the Father is in
Heaven while the Son is on earth as a man. So simple to
understand and believe, yet there are people who believe in
the doctrine of oneness which says God is just one person
who acts as the Father, the Son or the Holy Spirit.Jesus says to have eternal life, we must know the
Father and the Son. He omits the Holy Spirit. If the Holy
Spirit is the third person of Godhead equal to the Father and
the Son, Jesus must have commited the sin of blasphemy
by refusing to honour Him in the plan of salvation !

Jesus asks the Father to restore Him to the position He
had with the Father before the creation. This tells us Jesus
existed with the Father before any created thing existed -
He was not part of the creation but a member of the Eternal
God Family ! Jesus was only with ONE OTHER PERSON

Con't/....

[ Last edited by Truth.8 on 28-6-2004 at 04:20 PM ]

Truth.8

Page 5 (con't)



- the Father - before Heaven and earth was made. So how
can there be a triune God ?
In another incident of the Gospels, Jesus made this
powerful declaration : "No one knows who the Son is but
the Father, and who the Father is but the Son, . . . (Luke
10:22, NKJV).

Just think about these words for a minute.

"No one " is a strong term. It means not anyone else,
no other person or nor other single soul !

There is a deep exclusive relationship between the
Father and the Son. No one else has access or privilege to
this relationship - no one !

Unless you are suffering from spiritual myopia, you
should now be able to see that God the Father and His Son
are the ONLY TWO PERSONS in the Godhead !

Unity of God omits the Spirit

Jesus claimed perfect unity between Him and His
Father. He declared : " I and My Father are One." (John
10:30, NKJV). This does mean that Jesus and the Father are
one person because Jesus Himself testified : "I am not
alone, but I am with the Father who sent Me " (John 8:16,
NKJV}. Jesus is saying He is not the sole God-Being, He is
united with someone else - the Father.

The words I and My Father are one are very restricted
and limited - they do not involve any one else - again, Jesus
leaves out the Holy Spirit!

Why????

con't/......

[ Last edited by Truth.8 on 29-6-2004 at 10:58 AM ]

sonny~~

continue postin TRUTH8
me gonna response to each n every postin later  

peace

Truth.8

Originally posted by sonny~~ at 30-6-2004 11:04 AM:
continue postin TRUTH8
me gonna response to each n every postin later  

peace

no problem me will post more and more BUT makes sure u come with Bible verses not view & adding words.

i am quoting verses and verses.

Originally posted by Truth.8 at 29-6-2004 10:57 AM:
Page 5 (con't)



- the Father - before Heaven and earth was made. So how
can there be a triune God ?
In another incident of the Gospels, Jesus made this
po ...

Semoga Jehovah Witness....akan berkembang di dunia....dan menjadi agama yang paling besar......

Truth.8

Page 5 (con't)

For the simple reason the Holy Spirit was not a person
existing among the Father and the Son.

Those churches clamouring for unity under the Trinity
need to explain why Jesus omitted the Holy Spirit when He
spoke of Divine Unity in the Godhead :

I and My Father are ONE (John 10:30) . . .that they
all may be One, as You, Father are in Me, and I in You,
that they also may be ONE IN US. . . (John 17:21).....
that they may be one just AS WE ARE ONE . . (17:22 ). . .
that they may be ONE AS WE ARE (17:11).

If the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit are one, why
doesn't Jesus declare it ? Either the Trinity is a stupendous
lie or the the Son of God is a liar !

The Two Divine Witnesses
In John 8:17, Jesus said : " It is also written in your
law that the testimony of two men is true. I am one who
bears witness of Myself and the Father who sent Me bears
witness of Me " {NKJV}.

Jesus quotes this scripture from Deut.l9:15, " . . .by
the mouth of two or three witnesses that matter shall be
established." However, when Christ used this verse to
explain how many Divine Witnesses there were. He
excludes a third witness.

Why did He do that?

To explain to the Jews there were ONLY TWO
DIVINE WITNESSES - HE AND THE FATHER !

If the Holy Spirit was a person, then it should also be a
witness like the Father and the Son, and Jesus would have


con'd/....

Truth.8

Originally posted by gateway at 30-6-2004 11:35 AM:


Semoga Jehovah Witness....akan berkembang di dunia....dan menjadi agama yang paling besar......

for ur information, I am not jehovah witness, how many time do i hve to repeat:agr:

if u want to know my faith, pls visit this site:

http://www.tomorrowsworld.org

http://www.ucg.org

they are my faith.

Amen

Truth.8

Page 6 (cont)

used " three witnesses" instead of " two " when quoting
from Deut.l9:15. And if God were just one person - just
Jesus, the so-called oneness - then all of Jesus' statements,
declarations and words are not valid because according to
divine law they do not have an additional witness to back
up all what He uttered.

What about the verse," This is He who came by water
and blood - Jesus Christ ; not only by water, but by water
and blood. And it is the Spirit who bears witness, because
the Spirit is truth" (1 John 5:6, NKJV)

This verse talks about the coming of God in the flesh -
He was not only born a human but He also died a human.
These are two sources of evidence that God became a man
but there is a third witness - the Spirit. This Spirit is not a
third person but the Spirit of the Father which dwelled in
Jesus' body in its fullness (John 3:34). The Spirit of the
Father in Jesus also testified that God sent His Son in the
flesh so all three witnesses agree in its evidence : God came
in the form of human flesh (see 1 John 5:7).

Jesus stresses a Me and My Father God

In the book of John, Jesus constantly stresses a ME
AND MY FAT HER Godhead :

(1 )You neither know Me, nor My Father (8:19),

(2)You believe in God, believe also in Me (14:1),

(3)If you had known Me, you would know My
Father also (14:7),

(4)But now they have seen and also hated both
Me and My Father (15:24),
cont/......

[ Last edited by Truth.8 on 30-6-2004 at 11:48 AM ]

Originally posted by Truth.8 at 30-6-2004 11:45 AM:
Page 6 (cont)

used " three witnesses" instead of " two " when quoting
from Deut.l9:15. And if God were just one person - just
Jesus, the so-called oneness - then al ...

Manusia semakin maju semakin pintar.......tidak hairanlah...wujud pelbagai kepercayaan dan fahaman yang direka cipta....untuk memusnahkan saingan.

Kau ni truth pun...lebih kurang macam yahudi juga....kepercayaan kau terletak pada lutut manusia yang baru lahir didunia. :lol

Truth.8

Originally posted by gateway at 30-6-2004 03:13 PM:


Manusia semakin maju semakin pintar.......tidak hairanlah...wujud pelbagai kepercayaan dan fahaman yang direka cipta....untuk memusnahkan saingan.

Kau ni truth pun...lebih kurang macam yahud ...

i hve quote Bible verses to defend my faith but u  write based on ur views and opinion. Did not Christ says" Men should not live by bread along but every WORDS that procees from GOD."

Words mean the  BIBLE.


Now u defend ur side with Bible verses. One, Two or Three.

Truth.8

Page 7 (cont)

(5). . .because they have not known the Father
nor Me (16:3).

Everyone should be able to see by now Jesus never
proclaimed a one-in-three or three-in-one God, He preached
a I AND MY FATHER GOD - and I AND MY FA THER are
TWO PERSONS !

Jesus' teachings are plain. Jesus' revelation is
consistent. Everywhere in the book of John it is a ME AND
MY FATHER combination. Never and nowhere is it a Me,
My Father and the Spirit combination !

Those who believe the Holy Spirit is a third person
united with the Father and Christ have rejected the plain
words and plain teachings of Jesus !

Jesus came to reveal only the Father

One of the major purposes of Jesus' coming in the
flesh was to reveal the Father (John 1:18, Mat. 11:27).

How did Jesus reveal the Father to His disciples ? Did
He give them a heavenly vision ? Did He take them for a
spiritual trip to the Father's Throne ?

Concerning the Father's appearance, Jesus simply
stated: " He who has seen Me has seen the Father. " (John
14:9, 12:45, NKJV). Jesus revealed the Father THROUGH
HIMSELF. The very Person of Jesus was sufficient to
reveal the Father. Jesus is THE EXACT IMAGE of God
the Father (Col. 1:15). He has the same type of face and
body like God (Heb.l:3, 2 Cor.4:4,6).

Nowhere - NOWHERE - does it say the Holy Spirit
looks like the Father or has a face or even a body ! So how

cont'/....

[ Last edited by Truth.8 on 30-6-2004 at 10:25 PM ]

Originally posted by Truth.8 at 30-6-2004 05:33 PM:



i hve quote Bible verses to defend my faith but u  write based on ur views and opinion. Did not Christ says" Men should not live by bread along but every WORDS that procees from GOD.&quo ...

:lol Lelaki saja kah....perempuan tidak..... Bukan begini kah......Manusia hidup bukan dengan roti sahaja...tetapi dengan setiap perkataanKu.......

Bible itu cuma landasan kehidupan saja.....bible tidak akan dapat mengubah sifat dan sikap manusia....Manusia biasanya memperolehi sikap dan sifatnya daripada keadaan sekeliling yakini kehidupan keluarga dan persekitarannya....Kau bukan lahir saja di dunia..terus boleh baca Bible....

Kerana Engkau adalah manusia sama dengan saya....jadi walaupun kau bijak mengkritik dan mentafsir isi kandungan Bible....Sifat dan sikap kau...tetap tidak akan berubah......manusia tetap ada perasaan marah kecewa....benci...dendam....danlain-lain.....:lol .....ini kenyataannya.....

Kesimpulan saya......walaupun kau bermati-matian menuntut kebenaran tentang kepercayaan kau.......Sorilah.....kerana sikap kau....bukan seperti yang kau tuntut menurut kepercayaan dan tafsiran kau terhadap bible.....:lol

p/s  seorang pemimpin..tidak semestinya dapat memimpin dengan 100%.....oleh kerana dia manusia....tetap mempunyai keinginan untuk kepentingan diri sendiri......walaupun dia Padri...pastor...dan pemimpin dunia sekali pun.......kecuali.....Yesus Kristus.......:lol

Bukankah.....

sonny~~

Originally posted by Truth.8 at 2004-6-28 03:50 PM:

Page1

THE TWO MEMBERS OF ELOHIM

The Bible begins with, "In the beginning God created
the heavens and the earth " (Gen. 1:1, New International
Version). Most people assum ...

the crux of ur thread is to prove twoness belief ie there 2 gods in/as 1 god.  right?  n that jesus is god almighty HIMSELF.  right?  where its stated jesus is god in ur postins?  its like makin assumptions, puttin 2 n 2 to make twoness stick or trinity stick for that matter  

peace

[ Last edited by sonny~~ on 1-7-2004 at 11:36 AM ]

sonny~~

n where in ur postins which touch on holy spirit which trinity says hes also god almighty HIMSELF?  btw unitarian christians dont believe holy spirit or jesus is/r god  ;)  

sonny~~

Originally posted by Truth.8 at 2004-6-28 03:59 PM:
Page 2 (cont'd 1)

Verse 3 states every created life and object in the
universe was made by the Word. This makes the Word the
Creator. Heb.l:2, Col. 1:16 and Eph.3:9 all tell us God did
the creating work through Christ - this means before
anything was made - there existed TWO BEINGS in the
status of Eternal Almighty God !

Consider this : if the Holy Spirit was a third person
existing together with the Word and God, then John 1:1
should be written in this manner : In the beginning was the
Word and the Spirit, and the Word and the Spirit -were with
God, and were God.

nope ur interpretation is cockeye.  when the verses indicate god did creatin work thru christ that DONT mean jesus is god.  uh huh.  u should read the verses in the exact context ie god creates somethin thru man jesus christ as much god wins followers thru his prophets.  simple.  dont interprete the bible as u think fit accodin to ur twoness belief  :no:

sonny~~

yup theres no such thing as holy spirit is god almighty HIMSELF.  bible never teaches that neither did the bible teach jesus is god  

peace

sonny~~

Originally posted by Truth.8 at 2004-6-28 04:16 PM:
Page 3 (con't)

In the King James Version Bible, also called the
Authorized Version, there is this verse : " For there are
three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word and
the Holy Spirit, and these three are one "(I John 5:7).

This verse is a late inclusion by the translators of the
King James Version. It seems this verse was interpolated by
Trinitarian-influenced scribes in the 17th century \ It was
not part of the original Greek text. All the modem
translations omit it - it is nothing but a fraud !

God consists of the Father and the Son ; They are
TWO PERSONS !

there u go agin interpretin the bible to suit ur twoness belief.  yup trinity indeed is fraud.  nonetheless u cant insist ONE N ONLY ONE GOD is infact consistin of 2 persons/gods father n son.  

as me said u should understand the bible as it is written per se.  dont put different meanin from wots its written per se.  jesus has acknowledged hes sent by father.  hence in the true sense of the word n indeed he, a man is sent by god as much as prophets r sent by god.  by acknowledgin he jesus is sent by god is HARDproof that hes tellin u hes NO god.  simple  

peace

[ Last edited by sonny~~ on 1-7-2004 at 12:12 PM ]